Why is the city not doing something about these repeated violations of the noise ordinance?

Update from the SPPD: The City is currently in the process of re-evaluating the noise ordinance that would deal with such issues as noise allowed to escape from a business by leaving doors or windows open so that the Police Department is better equipped to deal with such issues. Should you continue to hear music from the Amsterdam which you feel may be in violation, I would encourage you to call the non-emergency line at 893-7780 to report the activity while it is occurring so that an officer can be dispatched to immediately resolve the issue. Issue reports posted here will continue to be forwarded to our attention, however you can help us by calling these reports in so that we may respond while they are occurring. Thank you.

Issue 1571851 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue.

Issue 1571904 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue.

Issue 1574513 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue.

Interestingly enough, I see that 6 trees were removed from in front of this business in 2014. I would hasten to say that replacing the trees would cut down on the noise as they would absorb some of it. Just an interesting observation.

Respectfully, did this individual realize they were moving to a street in a busy commercial area? Bars are loud. So if you value silence don't live on the same street with them. Our vibrant nightlife is part of what keeps our economy strong. Please do put our bars and nightclubs out of business with a punitive noise ordnance.

I'm not sure why my post is titled Pile of Tradh. I'll try the fix it but wanted everyone involved to know it wasn't directed at the individual posting the complaint.

While I can certainly respect and feel for someone who is bothered by noise I also have to suggest that if noise is something that really gets to a person - living along the main street in a downtown area may not be the best choice. The businesses in that area and truly all of downtown are what are driving our economy. The Edge District in particular is rapidly growing. I would argue that if The Amsterdam gets closed down what next? I'm more than certain another bar or even two might want to move into the area. Should all the loud business get shut down again and again? Or should something different be done such as installing sound deadending street scaping? This nightlife is an integral part of growing the economy city-wide and indeed is the reason why we are gaining a reputation Nation and even World Wide as a destination city. Please don't squash that reputation by shackling the very businesses that are helping drive it.

This establishment is always looking out for the community. Why would anyone consider raising a noise ordinance towards a bar on a busy street. I do not understand that if a person chooses to live in the downtown area, better yet on Central and not expect to hear local bars music. Whether its a weekday or weekend there is bound to be some type of noise coming from that type of establishment. The better way to solve this would be to move apts and maybe consider not living in the downtown area all together.

Regarding noise from the Amsterdam:

You want to live in a thriving downtown and be a part of the growing "scene" and "culture." However, you're too old and can't stand loud music? You can't have it both ways, drive away the patrons and then you won't be so cool living where you live.

Business will move along Central Ave. The City is thriving and growing. Money is coming into the city. Maybe you should have moved to Old Northeast instead??

Tai
St Pete resident for 40 years
Entrepreneur/local/ local supporter

This seems a little ridiculous. There is an entire city to live in...if you want peace and quiet then don't live on. Entral avenue and downtown no less. This is a wonderful establishment. They are a welcome addition to the downtown nightlife scene and supportive of the community at large. Please don't let this squeaky wheel become a bad apple and ruin it for the rest of us. They should either move or have more realistic expectations. Thank you.

My husband and I are young professionals who transplanted across the country from other large metro areas because we fell in love with the growing downtown St Pete area. Our city is getting world wide attention as an art and music destination because of local businesses like the Amsterdam. What a devastating blow it would be to force a pilar of the community to shut it's doors. If you want to live in quiet I have to question your decision to live on the street best known for bars, shops and restaurants. My hope is the city will keep booming and it may be best to live in a quiet neighborhood environment instead of complaining about the area where you chose to live.

What Herbie said!!

One more thing. We wirk with a nonprofit and The Amsterdam has supported our group with product donation and the use of their space. One night a few months ago, that noise put desperately needed funds in our account. The Amsterdam promotes many nonprofits and other small businesses. They don't deserve this kind of attack.

Downtown Saint Pete is a vibrant, upbeat community which supports local artists, musicians and progressive culture. Life, especially downtown life, is noisy - full of sound and fury. If you want peace and quiet, there are plenty of sleepy bedroom communities to choose from in our city. Rather than demand that others change for you to suit your lifestyle choices, better to rethink your choice of address. The music / nightlife scene is a big draw for our economy. Let's keep it that way. I remember the days when Downtown was quiet. There was no trade happening and no one lived here. The noise helped turn things around. I, for one, thank these struggling musicians and merchants for helping turn the city around and popularizing it. Now that it's popular, do we really want to shush them up? There's time enough for sleep in the grave - or the burbs.

My wife and I recently moved to the edge district. We are young educated professionals who have purchased a condo here. We love the vibrant music, entertainment and restaurant choices we have by living in "the edge" . There are many places that have live music in this area. One of our favorites is The Green Bench. What we really appreciate about The Green Bench is that they are respectful. They play live music, but they adhere to the sound ordinance. Meaning, they turn the music off by 11pm on week nights. 12am on weekends. The amsterdam does not do this. John Cullen allows his live music to go past these stated hours. FuzzFest is a prime example. Live music was playing well past midnight. Cops were called. Cop walked up to John Cullen and told him to turn off the music. John Cullen turns off music.

That is the problem right there!! Cops are enforcing a law that the owner should be. We want The Amsterdam to be a successful business here in The Edge, but we also would like our local businesses to be respectful as well. Telling people to move because we don't want to hear a concert at 1230 on Easter Sunday morning is probably not a viable solution to this issue. Following the rules that the other businesses follow in this area sounds like a better solution to this problem to me.

We all have to live together, and it would be an even better community if if would all be respectful of each other. We all want The Edge to be a great place to live and play. Please, let's all cooperate.

I support Amsterdam in their choice of having music til the late hours of the night. To have a thriving city, we need an active night life. If the noise is an issue, possibly an 11pm noise ordnance is the answer. However, i do not believe that this will solve the issue since asking every bar to do this is quite a task. And singling out one bar is just rude.

I am so glad to have a venue like The Amsterdam as part of my city - I have greatly enjoyed many evenings of FREE live music, as well as supporting them for many charitable events such as FUNK CANCER. It is a pity that people do not investigate their surroundings before selecting a residence that is in close proximity to a live music venue and I heartily hope that any issues between The Amsterdam and their neighbors are peacefully resolved.

I would like to comment in support of this wonderful and conscious establishment. Since the Amsterdam opened, they have supported many community events and hosted countless fundraisers, quickly becoming a thriving part of St. Petersburg's vibrant music and arts scene, which is one of the main draws to our town. As a resident who spends quite a bit of time there to see live music, I can vouch for the fact that the proprietors are very conscious of what time those doors get shut each night in order to comply with the noise ordinance. Yes, sometimes people walk in or out, or stand in the doorway for a minute, and yes, if you're awake and living across the street you might HEAR a few seconds of music, but I would venture a bet that it's not enough to keep people awake or wake them from sleep. If a little peep of loud music is enough to drive you to call the police, perhaps a Central Avenue address is not the place for you.

For the future....How about a code that requires that condos and apartments built in commercial areas have noise abatement standards. We live in a 1948 ranch and our neighbors are party animals. Inside, those concrete walls with good insulation and double pane windows, we can't hear a thing. Happy neighbors happy us. Doesn't solve the current problem. BTW, 11PM is the curfew for noise in residential areas. I think its silly to have the same noise standards for commercial or mixed use areas.

My Husband and I love The Amsterdam. The fact that downtown has evolved into something positive is great. The local music scene is one of the best qualities about the area. Downtown areas are suppose to be lively and vibrant. I support The Amsterdam and all the local businesses.

I'm not sure why everyone is beating up on the person that reported this constant noise! Sure, St. Pete needs a vibrant downtown, but not one that drives tax paying citizens out of their homes! These bars come and ago, but those of us that bought homes here have a right to peace every now and then. The City of St; Pete needs to put an ordinance in place that works for everyone, not just the business owners and the drunks that frequent their establishments.

Complying with noise ordinance does not equal closing the bar. Keeping the door closed is an easy fix. Setting up a band outside should not be a problem if the volume/amp is balanced with the needs of other people. The Amsterdam was aware of the fact that it faced a residential condo when it chose the location to open. Bars don't need to blast music late at night to attract or satisfy customers. If it's such a cool bar, the service and atmosphere should be it's own draw.

I'm sorry that the music is annoying this person, but why on earth would anyone rent an apartment in an entertainment district if they don't like the sound of entertainment? Changing city codes to accommodate people who make bad housing decisions isn't a very enlightened way of sustaining St. Petersburg's vibrant downtown community. And, as someone who is pushing 70 (so this is clearly not an age issue), I should add that we chose to live in Old Northeast, near Vinoy Park. We can't find a place to park during festivals and events, but we moved here for the festivals and events, not the parking.

I support The Amsterdamn and the right for small business owners to keep growing our economy. I live in the Euclid St Paul area, there are sirens and various other noises and issues because I can't afford an expensive Condo downtown. St. Petersburg is on the map to become the next "San Francisco" If our city starts clogging up the vibrant and yes loud beautiful sounds that spill over on Central now the consequences will be horrific to our economy. If these residents can't handle noise then respectfully come live under an Oak tree and pay for a cab to experience our city.

I want to add that I also volunteer with nonprofits, and The Amsterdam is one of the most reliable contributors in this city. They are superb, committed citizens of this community.

It's an interesting idea to decide to live downtown St Pete AND file a noise complaint...
You live DTSP..home to live music, bars, festivals, street fairs, the works! The nightlife being just as spritely as the daytime DTSP always has something going on, same goes for the Amsterdam.
The Amsterdam is known for amazing beers and live music. Live music is loud, bars are loud, Downtown St. Pete is loud.
If you don't want to hear DTSP and all its glory..don't choose to live in the heart of it.

Natashia

The Amsterdam is a great venue for local artists, singers, and songwriters. They are located in an area, downtown, where noise is expected. I've been there several times and I've never heard the sound so loud that I couldn't talk inside. Why do people live IN the city and complain about loud music? What's next cars?
Laura

I don't think anyone is beating up on the poster of this complaint. We are voicing our opinions which we will also share with City Council.
Here's another example. I bought my home in Old Northeast St. Pete and there are two problems that drive me crazy.
1. People who park on the street for events that don't live in my neighborhood.
2. The streets are too narrow for two cars to pass one another so you have to find a spot to pull to the curb and wait for one of the cars to pass.
Both of these situations serve a public need. Parking for downtown events and the preservation of the historic look of our narrow brick streets.
For me to ask the city to change these two issue with resident parking permits and widening of the streets on the basis of the fact that I own a house and pay taxes is ridiculous. Its the price I pay to be able to walk to Beach Drive and have lunch and walk along the waterfront. I knew these problems existed BEFORE I bought my home.
To think of the greater good is the best thing we can do for our city and and our community.
PS: I HATE the nasty dumpsters in my alley too. But to ask to change a system that works because I'm a little OCD and don't like dirty garbage cans.

While I sympathize with your complaint, I must say I fully support The Amsterdam. They are pioneers of this community and have not only helped foster the growth of the Edge District (and raising your property values), but Tampa Bay as a whole. It is places like The Amsterdam that provide quality nightlife entertainment helping make St. Petersburg the "#1 Millennial Draw in Florida" this year. Downtown St. Petersburg is growing quickly into a diverse and vibrant urban center - while that means many great things for residents and businesses alike, it also means activity must increase to all hours of the day and night. Central Ave and The Edge District are entertainment and nightlife hubs, residents must be aware that while they have many options for food, drink, and entertainment at their doorstep, there will also be noise and life happening at potentially inconvenient hours. Could you imagine this same complaint coming from someone who lived on Ybor City's 7th Ave, or in the French Quarter, or Hells Kitchen? It is the resident's responsibility to educate themselves about the area as it is presently and future plans for development.

It would also be wrong to paint the owners as aloof or disrespectful as they have created a hub for all members of the community to make new friends and connections, in addition to supporting local artists like myself time and time again (even if it didn't have a huge ROI for them). In fact, it was John and Zoie who convinced me to stay in Tampa Bay because of their support and conviction for St. Petersburg.

I urge the city to move in the right direction, recognize that the downtown renaissance is happening because of businesses like The Amsterdam. Support active nightlife and community building in your entertainment districts and also continue to nurture adjacent residential areas (Kenwood, Historic NE, etc) for people like Stephanie who want downtown living, but not so close to the pulse.

Ditto... An urban neighborhood is by nature a little loud. I live a block from the Amsterdam and like the music..(at least it's good music) Close your windows, open some wine relax...it's free!

Kenneth Cook (old guy)

The Amsterdam is a fantastic place and is very involved in this community hosting various great events. I will voice again what most people have been saying, you chose to live in a downtown environment. Downtown environments come with a certain amount of noise. Your complaint is like someone moving into Manhattan and making a complaint that there's too much traffic. Erroneous on all accounts.

The Amsterdam is one of the reasons I love living in St. Pete! You cant expect to live downtown and not have some level of sound intrusion.

I often come all the way from New Tampa to St Pete and mainly to the Amsterdam. In other words though I live in Tampa I fuel St.Pete economy because well meaning citizens have in one way or the other messed with the Tampa downtown, destroyed it, and killed it's economy. Which is a big reason why Hillsborough tax bracket is so high. You need to get the money from somewhere. The Amsterdam is a musical venue licenced as such. Of course it is going to be noisy. One has to feel privileged to live there and take the noise or if not I would respectfully suggest you move to the suburbs as I did. I truly don't believe that the Amsterdam is any noisier than its competitors. In fact it's a very respectable venue that does a lot of community, charitable , and artistic focused program. I just attended TedxUSF were they discussed the urgent need to support the scientific community which the speaker said would boost the local economy. And which venue did they show a photo of hosting such community debates? The Amsterdam. Let's not cut the hand that feed us. With all due respect complaining about a rational noise level coming from businesses that are noisy by nature such as restaurants, clubs, bars, music venues makes no sense at all. Night life is a huge boost to the economy and seriously strengthens the local community in many of its social aspects. Please let's do better than leave it that way, let's support it.

Trumpet player is correct. It's not that we don't want a vibrant downtown, or the Amsterdam to close. All we want it them to abide by ordinances. 11pm mon-thurs and midnight fri-sat. And keeping it within decibel levels. We are asking then to be good neighbors to the people that live there, not just to community organizations.

I love the Amsterdam! I can't understand why someone would move directly across the street or anywhere on Central Ave and have an expectation of quiet at any time. I would think that's why one would move to that area to begin with, to be a part of all of the hustle, bustle and excitement in that area! Part of being a good neighbor is also have realistic expectations about where you live, like loud music and the typical sounds of the night life the downtown area brings in!

The Amsterdam is one of the reasons that areas is vibrant. Without businesses like it the area wouldn't be worth living in. I go to downtown St. Pete specifically to go to the Amsterdam. If you don't want to live in an area with noise then don't live in downtown. Try the suburbs. That's what they are for.

The Amsterdam is one of the places that keeps dtsp alive. It's so vibrant with local music, art, craft beers and all the fundraisers it hosts to raise awareness for bigger events! The people complaining should have considered their living situation before starting this argument, there is no valid argument in reality. The doors remain closed and the music stays within the decibel limit. Keep dtsp alive, keep the music alive!

Stephanie,

You cannot complain about a situation you choose to be in. The Edge continues to flourish and such unnecessary complaints are a hinderance to the continued development. You live in an area near a Major League Baseball stadium, many public establishments with late hours, and you are going to complain about the activity in the area?

This is not an issue to be resolved by the city. It is more of a problem with the apparent quality of the establishment you choose to live in. Clearly, the building sound-proofing should be reviewed. Please do not waste the time of the city, and especially the police department, on such a frivolous complaint.

Further, there are many establishments within the downtown and Edge districts near residences that have activity late into the night. The Amsterdam should not be singled out because of residents that live in an establishment with poor construction.

I value quiet time and sleep, so I choose to live away from the main areas of activity in Kenwood. I suggest you consider alternative areas. Though, not Kenwood, we prefer nice folks in our area.

Respectfully,

Neighbor, fellow St. Pete resident, fellow renter, and Amsterdam customer John

I live across the street from the Amsterdam and I have no problem with the noise level. Anytime I am inside the bar, they close the doors at night at the required time. The Edge District is an amazing place to live and spend time because of places like the Amsterdam. Like others have said, don't move downtown if you want a retirement home like setting. It is ridiculous and embarrassing to have neighbors who complain like this. There are plenty of 55+ communities that probably have lights out at 8pm if you're looking for quiet all the time.

St. Petersburg has a multitude of beautiful, quiet neighborhoods to live in. Many of which are only a short distance from Downtown. I can understand wanting peace and quiet at night, that's why I moved into a neighborhood that provides it. Complaining about the nightlife in the area is like complaining about traffic from Rays games. You know it's gonna happen. If you find it disagreeable, you shouldn't live there.

Honestly the real problem is the location/design of overpriced condos in the first place. It's was obvious that businesses and venues were going to grow west along Central Ave since well before they were built. (Probably the reason they were even built at all!) There's plenty of condo buildings in the Downtown core area and you don't seem to hear about anybody having any problems with the nightlife.

My question is that when you moved in, did you look across the street and see bars, nightlife, etc? I understand your right to peace and quiet, but living where you do means that you live next to one of the reason why this city is thriving, energetic, and yes noisy. But that's why people usually choose to live next to the action, because they want to be part of it, not complain about it.

The Amsterdam is good about keeping the doors closed after 11pm (12 on weekends). Sitting right outside, traffic noise is more than what music noise is emitted. If the complainer doesn't like living in a vibrant urban setting, perhaps she should move to The Villages.

I'm 62 and I love Amsterdam and many other bars. The Villages comment was directed at retired people. Keep it civil!!

Downtown St Petersburg is booming. Residents across the city and downtown should be glad. Let's not legislate everything so the popularity drops back to where Tampa is now (dead). If you don't like the hustle bustle of a busy downtown, move to Tampa!

The person shouldn't have moved downtown and across the street from bars if they need complete silence. Long Live The Amsterdam.

I can't help but wonder if people think that "noise ordinance" means "complete silence after 11PM." The current ordinance is based on decibel level, and I can't imagine that level is being exceeded here. I live in the area and agree with the comment above about the noise level from street traffic being louder than the sound coming from the Amsterdam. Saying "If you don't like it, move!" might seem a little harsh, but the general sentiment is correct: if you live in one of the most vibrant, quickly expanding districts of a city that's becoming internationally recognized for its art, music, and culinary scenes, and you expect it to be absolutely quiet after midnight seven days a week, you need to adjust either your expectations or your location.

As one of the musicians playing on the night this complaint is referring to I would like to make you aware of a couple things. The doors to the Amsterdam were closed prior to us starting at 10pm out of respect of the noise ordinance and people living near by. We also make sure to keep our PA and amps at a lower volume as to not bother those living across the street.

The Amsterdam is run by two of the most driven and community conscious people I know. They strive to abide by the noise ordinances and encourage the musicians they hire to do so as well. Perhaps if the individual complaining came down to try one of the great craft beers on tap, met some of the super cool locals that hang out there, and took a listen to some of the great artists featured each week they would feel a little better about their living situation.

In the last 10+ years, Downtown has transformed into a suddenly popular place to live. Noise complaints are on the rise - not necessarily because there's more noise, but because there are now many more professionals and retirees complaining about it. It's an economic gentrification sort of issue really. "Professional" is a relative term. New residential space (catering almost exclusively to higher income "professionals" and retirees) continues to mushroom out of control. It has increased traffic, infrastructure stress and many other problems. Do I complain? Well, sometimes yes, but I also accept that it's part of life in a booming city. These "professionals" bring revenue into our city. I respect that. Professionals should, in turn, respect the young counterculture that put this city on the map to begin with, and the merchants who cater to them. They ("professional" musicians and "professional" bar owners) also have to continue to earn a living. Were it not for them, there would still be tumbleweeds bouncing down Central Ave. and we wouldn't even be having this discussion. Counterculture built this town, and counterculture keeps different hours. Counterculture also breaks rules. It's one of the reasons they are visionary trail blazers who can turn dead-end cities into diverse, thriving communities. Where I happen to live is very noisy, but it's my choice to live where I live. I bought myself some better windows. If one lives next to a bar, club, or concert venue, it's going to be noisy. Reasonably, one really has to expect this. If everyone starts griping about steadfast adherence to rules and regulations, it makes things uncool for everyone fast. Live and let live. Frankly, I don't want to live in a city that rolls up the sidewalks at midnight, sending out cops to enforce someone's perceived right to a good night's sleep. There are lots of other places to choose from beyond the city limits which do not conflict with a conventional 9-5 lifestyle. It's really hard for me to see your point if you moved into a place right next to a bar.

Well said.

Just to clarify, for all of you who think that we're bad people that live in these condos: The Amsterdam opened about a year and a half ago I believe...maybe the end of 2013. Previously the area the bar is now is was vacant. The coffee shop next door has been there slightly longer than The Amsterdam, has live music at night on occassion, and is not an issue at all.

I don't think anyone said you were bad people. I personally think that life is about compromise and living in a mixed use area means there will be noise.

Thanks, Lucinda! There is definitely some confusion here. It's not that we are asking for quiet. We are asking for consideration! Everyone has a limit of what they can tolerate, and when it's a violation of codes, it's within our rights to say something. Not everyone will agree with us, and that's fine. But we are allowed to voice our concerns, without people attacking us for living in condos that were not next to a live music venue at any point until recently. And picking up and selling your condo isn't really feasible for everyone, so we're hoping to find a happy compromise!

John Cullen is one of the most honorable men I know. I'm sure he's already looking for a reasonable solution.

Yes, Lucinda. Central Ave has been zoned mixed use for decades. If you live there, there is always the possibility of a bar or restaurant opening up nearby. Within a mile radius of The Amsterdam are over 25 establishments that feature music on a regular basis...and I'm not counting concert venues like Jannus or Mahaffy. What the original complainer fails to grasp is that businesses like bars and restaurants survive on the nighttime patrons. Operating 9-5, they couldn't exist. I frequent The Amsterdam often. They are good about keeping the doors closed at the prescribed time, and very little sound can be heard even immediately outside on the sidewalk. The Edge Business District shouldn't have to shut down at 5pm just to suit one chronic complainer. If she doesn't like city life, she should move.

I don't think anyone is suggesting they shut the music down at 5PM. If this ends up at City Council cool heads and calm voices will make a better case for lenient noise rules in mix use areas. Suggesting people move will make us look like unreasonable people. Just sayin. The Amsterdam is my favorite bar too so I understand why you want to defend John and Zoie.

Lucinda, Genero's , next door to The Amsterdam, has gotten complaints about indoor music at 6pm. There are two people who are the sources of all the complaints. It would appear their goal is to force the businesses across the street to close before dark. That is purely unreasonable, and the reason "the SPPD doesn't do anything" is because the businesses are operating within the applicable codes for mixed zoning. Some people just can't cut living in the city. The complainer appears to be one. She should move, because the city night life isn't going to shut down at dark just because she can't handle common urban noises.

I support just about any establishment that provides vibrant, artistic, locally owned, grown, and sponsored events. These places, and The Amsterdam is one par excellence, attract young, artistic, professionals to the city. Creating an expressive spaces for people to be is really, really crucial to the continued development of this city. I really think that any condo owner along Central Avenue would do better to invest in a pair of earplugs than to call the police. And I think that the police's best response would be to issue the disturbed residents with a pair of ear plugs....

What I hope most is that more ordinances are passed in favor or an even MORE vibrant and an even NOISIER downtown district. I want more art, more music, more young people, more places to drink amazing craft beer, more performance spaces, and more places to be out late. St Pete is quiet enough - plenty of quiet neighborhoods.... I want our ONE busy, "noisy" district to be consistently defended and supported.... Because I want it to stay busy, and I want it to be even noisier.

If I hear one more statement about old peopl vs young people I'm going to exploit John's respect for us to convince him to play only country music and oldies for the rest of April!!

Lucinda, it's not old people vs, young people. As a friend (who is a Hills Co Judge) once told me: "There's two kinds of people in the world. Those who like to have fun, and those who just can't stand it that others are having fun".

I agree!

As a 20 year resident I have seen the growth of this beautiful city fist hand , and thanks to hard working bis owners like these we have a safer thriving city . Quite frankly many of our city laws and ordinances need updated let's start with a easy one . Move it to 12 on weekdays and 2 on weekends. Done !

Did I seriously just read that? Did the Mayors Action Center actually say/admit in their initial post they would "immediately" send out a police officer upon receiving a noise complaint? Wow. I'm blown away. Speechless. That is CRAZY!!! I have owned a house for 10 years near 16th Street N & 22nd Avenue N. I cannot begin to tell you how many times our tenants and many of our dear elderly neighbors have called the police to complain about a REAL crime (such as obvious drug dealing, domestic violence, auto theft and one of my very own personal favorites, breaking and entering) where the caller had to wait for a ridiculous, nearly obscene amount of time to have an officer dispatched to the crime scene. Two key words folks: CRIME SCENE. I guess it was because the poor officers were tied up doing completely ridiculous non-essential tasks such as writing up a complaint about noise. Noise may be annoying, and yes, possibly even against the local noise ordinance...but good gracious...it is not an actual crime that requires the time, effort, skill and energy of a real live armed police officer. Do we really need to send the police for this type of complaint? Isnt there a volunteer police squad of retirees that might be better suited to handling such non-emergent, frivolous complaints? Perhaps maybe we could find a small group of unarmed ex-mall cops that might be excited to handle such a complaint? Can we not find more effective, efficient use for our highly trained police force, (many of whom are probably also members of the SWAT team)? Must we waste our city's valuable resources in such a foul manner? I am an emergency room nurse and I spend quite a bit of my time collaborating with police officers, Sheriff Dept Deputies, and Highway Patrol Officers. When I think of the endless list of dangerous or violent people the police take off the street and bring the ER for various reasons (quite often because they are hopped up on multiple illicit drugs), I can't help but question where is the sense in "immediately dispatching an officer" to a NOISE COMPLAINT??? I guess the squeaky wheel gets the grease in downtown St. Pete. Lastly, if the non-emergent noise complaint was made on 911, and it sounds like it may have been, then maybe the caller should be punished if it continues.

Go back an read the comment again. It says call the non-emergency number and a COMMUNITY SERVICE officer will be dispatched. Attacking the Mayor's action line and the police department HURTS our efforts to enact reasonable noise ordinances in our mixed use areas. I am 100% on the side of extending the hours and raising the decibels in mixed use areas. But cool heads and calm voices are how we accomplish that.

Lucinda, I am not attacking the Mayors action line, nor the SPPD. I am suggesting the whole process may need to be overhauled for filing noise complaints or for handling actual violations of the codes. There has to be a better, more efficient way for the city to handle the procedure from beginning to end without involving the police in any manner. The citizens, in my opinion, should not bother the police with such complaints unless there is some element of danger present. The police have much bigger fish to fry. Clearly, the Amsterdam does not intend to cause purposeful harm or injury in any way of any person. Judging from the amount of community involvement and amazing support the Amsterdam has wholeheartedly and unselfishly offered, their intention is to continue building bridges, not burn them. Furthermore, I wish all parties involved a peaceful, happy (and hopefully speedy) solution. Downtown St Pete is alive and kicking. It is a wonderful, beautiful vibrant community that we all hope will continue to thrive, even through the various stages of inevitable growing pains.

I agree with everything except police (community service) officers. You need someone to document when business owners that are not as responsible as John violate repeatedly.

I live at 1010 Central. I personally have called the police because of noise violations at The Amsterdam. I have lived here for three years,well before John Cullen opened up The Amsterdam. All of the businesses in this are follow the noise ordinance 100% of the time with one exception, The Amsterdam

The latest incident was Easter Sunday. John Cullen had a band playing outside at 1215am. I called the police. They came out at 1230 am and confronted John Cullen. I personally saw this confrontation. Only after being confronted by the St
Pete police did the music stop. See folk, this is the issue right here. Breaking the law!

People posting here need to remember that you are coming into my neighborhood to play. You are coming onto my block to drink beer and listen to you favorite bands. I own a piece of this block. I bought it and I support it every year with my tax money. I've earned the right to defend it. I expect all businesses on my block to abide by the law. I expect patrons to do the same. Telling me to move because you don't want to follow the laws is not an acceptable solution. Having the Amsterdam follow the law is the solution to this issue.

Telling residents to move because you find it an inconvenience to follow the law is reckless on your part. Have fun, visit my community and enjoy yourselves. Just do it as as law abiding citizen.

Cops stop the music!! I live at 1010 central. Been here before The Amsterdam arrived. I personally called the police Easter Sunday at 1215am because John Cullen had a live band performing outside. I watched as the cop approached and confronted John Cullen. After a brief conversation he immediately stopped the band. The time was 1230 am Easter Sunday. Folks, this is the issue. Failure to follow the law.

Live music is great. We support it by visiting many places in The Edge, but businesses must follow the rules. We all must live and work together and it needs to be done with a mutual respect for each other. Violating the law is not respectful.

Folks posting here need to remember that you are coming into our neighborhood to play and party. We own a piece of this neighborhood and we support it with a hefty tax bill paid each year to the city. I have a responsibility to keep my neighborhood save and to make sure all laws are followed, including sound ordinances. Telling me and my family to move move because you find it an inconvenience to follow the law is negligent on your part.

Fix this issue Amsterdam by following the law!!!

For Stephanie and any others who have complained about the noise - something I'm genuinely curious about is how loud it is within those condos. It's honestly why I have a hard time getting behind your complaints. I meant what I said above about how I feel for you. I really do. I know where I'm coming from - and I suspect a lot of others who are passionate about this do as well - is that I've been at The Amsterdam many times. Often late at night on a Friday or Saturday. I've seen how diligent the owners are about keeping the door closed and the noise down. I've been able to sit at a table on the sidewalk and easily have conversations in a normal voice with no issues. I have a very hard time believing it can really be so loud as to be an annoyance nearly 100 feet away behind closed doors/windows and drapes or whatever else.
That's not to say that when the doors open I expect it can sound quite loud. Honestly I still don't think it would be enough to bother me but I'm trying to be opened minded here. But even then, it's just a few seconds when a customer walks in or out and that can't exactly be stopped.
Just wanted to offer an insight to where at least one person on the other side of this is.
Have you ever measured the sound level with a decibel meter in your home after hours and with both your doors/windows closed as well as the business?

@trumpet player

It is not your neighborhood. It is OUR neighborhood. A neighborhood that is active. There are other options other than moving. Maybe ear plugs? Maybe better construction for sound-proofing. Restricting activity due to a few individuals at the detriment of the establishment, its patrons, and the economic development of the area is unfortunate. Could you find something else to complain about and not waste the time of our police department and its community officers.

Thanks.

Your neighbor living in OUR neighborhood.

Excuse me? YOUR neighborhood? That are is zoned commercial/mixed use. The street level is EVERYONES neighborhood.

John and Lucinda. You miss the issue. The issue is violating the sound ordinance law. Address that directly. You break the law and you need to be held accountable. This area is a mixed use area. Laws are in place to protect residents and owners. The police enforce these laws when business owners do not. Break the law and police become involved. John, you speak of options. Here's a good one. Amstrdam obeys our current sound ordinance law. Problem will then go away. Don't loose site of the issue guys.

I understand the issue completely. I was merely responding to the person who said this was none of our business because it was their neighborhood.

lose*

Further, we don't know for sure if the noise ordinance was violated. The police don't routinely measure the decibel levels but rather quiet the situation. Some noise is permitted 24 hours a day.

I'm trained in using the FHWA Traffic Noise Model (TNM) software to evaluate roadway traffic noise. Twenty trees on the sidewalk will do nothing to abate noise levels any appreciable amount. However, if the perception is that it will, by all means plant some trees. We love trees. Out of sight, out of mind. Installing insulated windows is probably a better alternative. Or install a side door and move the patio seating to the side patio so the front door opens less often.

BREAKIN THE LAW BREAKIN THE LAW !!! ^ ^

(posted on behalf of Assistant Chief Luke Williams, SPPD)

Thank you for your e-mail, SeeClickFix # 1574593, dated April 6, 2015, regarding the noise issues emanating from the Amsterdam Bar, located at 1049 Central Avenue. The Mayor has asked that I respond directly to you in reference to this issue.

Lt. Markus Hughes was assigned with looking in to the complaint of excessive noise from this venue. He made contact with the management of the bar on April 10, 2015, and they reviewed the current city ordinances with regard to amplified music coming from the establishment after certain hours. Current city ordinances address sound that is plainly audible from over 100 feet from the building after the hours of 11:00 pm weeknights and 12:00 am weekends. Lt. Hughes advised the bar management that they could close the doors which would help reduce the sound and that a violation of the city ordinance carries a fine amount of $218.

Lt. Hughes returned to the location after midnight on Saturday, April 11, and noted that the doors to the business were closed. There was no noise violation occurring on that date. He, along with his squad will continue to monitor the business in the future.

As a part of the current city ordinance in effect to address this specific issue, a complainant must be identified in order for the officers to take enforcement action for the violation. I encourage you to contact us via the non-emergency number (893-7780) when an ordinance violation is occurring. The responding officer would then meet with you personally to observe the violation themselves from the distance of your home. As long as you are willing to identify yourself as a complainant for the violation, then the officer will be able to issue a citation to the establishment.

If you have any further concerns or complaints with this issue, please feel free to contact Lieutenant Markus Hughes at (727) 893-4821. Thank you for bringing your concerns to the attention of the St. Petersburg Police Department.

Sincerely,

Luke C. Williams
Assistant Chief of Police
Uniform Services Bureau

We all have choices in life, and that being said I believe that people should be aware of their surroundings. If you move where there is an airport then you get lots of planes flying by. Are we going to tell the airports that they need to stop because there is someone living near by that doesn't approve of the noise. If we move where there are railroad tracks are we going to make the trains stop because we don't like the noise.
Get off your high horse and realize where you live. That was Your Choice! You couldn't be so naive that you think that downtown is a nice quite place to live. The noise complaint should not be an issue. I have been to the Amsterdam and enjoy the taste of the place. From the art décor to the various types of music and craft beers. I feel John Cullen has brought something good to the neighborhood because I had never been drawn to that part of Central until it had something worth going to, and that would be the Amsterdam! I understand noise issues and restrictions and feel that businesses shouldn't have to suffer over a few disgruntled people.

Matt , did you notice that trumpet player eluded your question about the decibel levels. Obviously they are just a complainer and knows nothing of what they speak. Just what are the decibel levels in your comfy home that is now a terrible place to live because people are enjoying themselves across the street? You haven't made but one good excuse and that was at Easter. And have you been to the Amsterdam and met the owners? If that's "Your Neighborhood" , Trumpet Player , then why don't you make friends instead of waves. Didn't your mom teach you anything?

St Pete police has been to the Amsterdam on numerous occasions. There are no decibel levels spelled out in the ordinance. Read Lt Hughes response for clarification on this issue. Every time I have called the police they have shut the noise problem down. Clyde, talk to John about this. Easter is not the only time he has been in violation. It's been numerous times. This is why St Pete police dispatched a lieutenant to address the issue. We want people to obey the law. The noise from the Amsterdam has been a problem for awhile. Telling us to recognize where we live and to accept a business breaking the law is unacceptable. Following the law is a more responsible way to act. There is no decibel level ordinance. There is a sound ordinance. The Amsterdam has violated the sound ordinance. This is what Lt Hughes addressed with John. It's that plain.

By the way. Did you hear Tampa is building a "no whistle zone" for trains running thru areas of downtown Tampa? The city realized that they needed to come up with a compromise between businesses and residents. Trains were blowing their horns late at night and disturbing residents. Right now Tampa is building a quiet zone which is a stretch of track running thru areas of downtown Tampa containing more lights and crosswalks so trains won't have to blow their whistle. See Clyde, the city listened to their residents and businesses and came up with a compromise. They work together to fix the problem.

"Dam fans". Contrary to what the owner of the Amsterdam said on his Facebook page, we are not starting a war. We enjoy all businesses in this neighborhood. Including the Amsterdam, we just really need the laws to be followed. Come on guys, we live in a great place. Let's keep it that way.

Issue 1602556 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue.

Issue 1601283 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue.

St. Petersburg Florida is quickly gaining a reputation for having an exceptional and diverse art and music culture. This culture is driven and perpetuated in part as a result of choices made by smart and diligent business operators like John Cullen and Zoie Torres. They run a fantastic bar where you can count on good beer, great service, great company and fantastic music any night you choose. The music that these operators bring in to the city drives the economy and feeds the creative ambiance. An ambiance that is so so tantalizing people come from all over to enjoy the vibe. They come from all over and they spend their money in St. Petersburg. I would agree with many of the previous commenters who point out that you chose to live on a major thoroughfare in a hopping metropolitan area and that you might have considered the noise level implied when choosing your residence. Be careful asking to change ordinances. It could be costly to a budding economy. It could change the traffic patterns which would change the revenue patterns for these businesses. You could chase away the very business owners and risk takers that got the city's economic gears moving. That would result in property values dropping and job losses all over the city. I extend my thanks to John, Zoie and all of the operators in St. Petersburg who work hard to bring us all excellent entertainment options. Keep on doing what you're doing! I'll be at the Amsterdam this weekend listening to some excellent music in that fine establishment!

I was at The Amsterdam the past 2 nights. Doors were shut prior to 11PM, and there was no music from there heard outside. However, I could plainly hear music coming from Enigma half a block away, after midnight. I suspect the haters are blaming The Amsterdam for noise originating from elsewhere.

Noise is noise loud is loud and the city needs stronger enforcement of these laws. In commercially zoned area yes there should be a whole new fair ordinance. I chose not to live there because of the all day and night noise. I still enjoy going there even with the noise.I don't want to live with that noise. But every night the neighbors here are playing boom boom all night drinking fighting and just ye hawing. Police don't do much. what is loud to one person is not loud to another so where does the city draw the line?! residential areas are a whole new ball game and should be treated as such. Those are the monsters that the city should be concerned about. The residential loud noise makers and disrespectful ignorant lots..I could never figure why ruin good music by having it so loud. The monsters who take from St Pete's economy. not contribute. I am not a bar goer but it is a business area a must needed thriving area. we can not overlook the law but we can consider the hours .What about our right to domestic tranquility?. People seem to forget that right!!!!!!! Hope a compromise comes soon. best of luck. so no matter where you go in st pete to wine dine tour or hang it is loud very loud to me. I cant even escape at my home.we sometimes have to leave st pete to get peace.You really do not need noise to thrive and because it is such a good establishment it should not be any different as far as the ordinance goes......The law is there and needs to be enforced if liable. god bless everyone! no exceptions to the rule.

The Amsterdam is a dump, I don't know what you PRO Amsterdam comments must be- relatives? employees? The apartments and the condos to the north have been there long before the bar ever opened. Do you really think the bar brings more income to the city than these large apartments and condos? The original complaint was about a Sunday night, there is no excuse to have that much noise from 1 bar. Besides, they won't be in business much longer, they can't compete. With or without noise complaints. Ciao Amsterdud!

Church here is as loud as the bars our houses shake and the kids stay in because some have sensitive hearing and the elderly sure don't appreciate it. why aren't they cited at 9 am.?. kinda wonder where any respect .from church has gone. We have been here longer than the church/bar. When we have visitors which is quite often we leave St Pete. We NEVER EVER go downtown at night or even during the day. Don't like it downtown so I don't go there. NOISE is a serious issue and really needs to be addressed. Moving should NEVER be an issue. following the rules of society and the land you live on. St Pete is loud and yes I am seriously leaving when I sell my home. I know we have had enough of do whatever you want city. haters will hate it was a post about a valid popular complaint in this city. chill out and let the complaint be solve. period. wow
I agree with engine.

City staff periodically review past SCF reports that are made both from citizens and internally from various departments, and in an effort to clean-up old issues that were resolved some time ago, we are marking as 'closed' those issues that were submitted in the past for which the work has been completed or the issue has otherwise been resolved.

If you think for any reason that the issue you submitted in the past might still be unresolved, please feel free to submit a new report with the SeeClickFix St. Pete website and we will make sure the issue is directed to the appropriate City department to be addressed as soon as possible.

Thank you,
Mayor's Action Center