Description
Earlier this week I thought it would be nice to buy a lunch at a nearby cafe and take it out on the Green to eat. Think again---
Nearly ever bench in the green is being used by homeless people to sleep on and hang out on all day and all night. Many of them are trashed (the benches and the homeless dudes). Even when you find an empty bench it is surround by the trash they leave behind.
When I say I want this issue "fixed" I don't mean sterilizing the homeless, and I realize times are tough. I just wish that everyone could use the green and it wasn't a rough sleeping encampment treated like junk by derelicts.
At the outdoor concert last weekend, police came around and forced people to leave their post-concert eating, drinking, and conversing at 10pm. Do they make the homeless people leave? No. Seems like the wrong set of priorities for use of public space.
24 Comments
CT Livable Streets Campaign (Registered User)
Thanks for posting this. I spend a lot of time on the Green and agree that the trash is a serious issue. One of the issues there is the large number of discarded cigarette butts, though that is not necessarily related to "homeless dudes."
Focusing on keeping the Green clean, for example by creating or enforcing smoking bans, could go a long way towards prioritizing the space for salubrious public life.
The Green should be treasured, not treated as a trashcan. Would you like to volunteer to contact the Proprietors of the Green regarding your issue?
Beatrice (Guest)
I think the NHPD has more important things to do than rounding up homeless people. Let's work on ending homelessness instead of wishing they stay out of sight.
unhappy (Guest)
Beatrice, my last point was that the space isn't open to all people when police send everyone away from the green at 10pm *but* the homeless. I live downtown, I walk my dog every morning on the green, and every morning I see people encamped on benches and under trees.
Of course throwing trash around is a problem for all sorts of people, but when you see someone crashed out on a park bench all day, and the area surrounding *their* bench littered with butts, trash, and little vodka bottles, it isn't unfair to associate the two.
There definitely seems to be an increase in people sleeping on the green with this weather. I'm not saying anyone should be "rounded up." And I agree ending homelessness is a good priority--but how do you want to do that? If the green is an easy place to lazy away a day, score drugs, and recreate, people will congregate there.
Beatrice (Guest)
me (Guest)
joey (Guest)
unhappy (Guest)
Update (this is the OP):
I called NHPD's non-emergency number to ask about the 10pm curfew on the green and was told to contact the downtown substation. Their voicemail system is wonky/broken, but I happened to see Lt Sweeney (who is in charge) sitting in her cruiser at the corner of Chapel and Church.
I asked about the issue of being asked to leave the green and she said that the green is private property, not a public park. She said that the cops come through at the request of the owners, and the owners are who sets the times. Then she asked if I had posted something about this early today on the internet. I was surprised by the quickly collapsing divide between cyberspace and the real world and said "no." But hey, I'm glad she was reading (or someone was). Thanks for that!
She said that the homeless are in shelters overnight and come back at 5am, when they take over the benches again. I'm not so sure about that, but according to her, being on the green at night is illegal. Anyone know more about that? I can think of numerous times I've walked home late at night (trespassing?) and seen people asleep on benches and under trees.
Commuter (Guest)
robn (Registered User)
Perhaps rather than focussing on the homeless, maybe there should be more focus on the proprietors.
robn (Registered User)
Some people become homeless because they are insane, others because of drug or alcohol addiction, some were born into poverty, some are undereducated and some unintelligent, some are just plain unlucky and their best try and intentions just went wrong. Regardless, this thread really isn’t about someone’s social status, it’s about anyone’s behavior on the New Haven Green. If some perceptible slice of the current homeless population has slipped into bad behavior on the green (as have other groups in the past; notably rambunctious teenagers) its easily repairable by stepped up oversight.
E (Registered User)
I find this entire discussion to be extremely discriminatory. If we replaced the word of "homeless" for "black" or "latino" - the thread would have been closed. Ive been homeless, Ive had to live in my car, Ive had to sleep in the park. I would rather see people sleeping on a bench in a park then sleeping in a doorway, in an open car, or elsewhere. Unfortunately, they have no where else to go - shelters are for nights only on a first come first serve basis or in extreme weather conditions. Unless you want to financially help them out of the situation, move on and concentrate on the real issue - the trash. Ive lived in CT for 4 years now and MOST people litter. It is NOT a homeless issue, its a Connecticut issue. People are nasty, in general, here. They throw things on the ground feet from the garbage because they are too lazy. People throw crap out their car because they don't want to keep the trash in their nice or hooptie cars. The mindset here in Connecticut is to throw crap on the ground where ever one is done with their trash. Lets concentrate on that issue and leave the homeless alone unless you personally want to get involved in helping their situation. Many are NOT alcoholics or addicted to drugs - and many don't get addicted until they BECOME homeless from other reasons.
So again, find a solution for the trash, help the homeless or move along.
guest (Guest)
I live in the Taft, and the New Haven Green, therefore, is my front yard, my only immediate green space. (Talik about greening our roofs -- the Taft is vast, untapped green roof potential)
At first I didn't really get uptight about the homeless hanging out on the Green all day, but over time I realized there are some major problems.
I don't mind people sleeping at night on the benches because the shelters are dangerous you know -- I don't know if people realize that most decent homeless people stay away from the shelters because they are robbed there.
So, I don't mind homeless sleeping in the park or being in the park but here are things I DO mind, BIG time:
1.) A darn substantial proportion of them have been evicted from dirt cheap subsidized apartments because they habitually spent their rent money on drugs -- they are addicts.
2.) some of them are uncivilized, loud, unreformable, permanently damaged obnoxious jerks who begrudge the squirrels a decent nights sleep.
3.) Many, many many men are using the Green, especially the College St. end, as a urinal. In fact, the upper Green is just a giant urinal and you can sit Nowhere without a thick blanket unless you want the odor to penetrate into your clothing.
At first glance it seems like such a pretty place, but it isn't.
I decided to sit on the lawn and read a newspaper, leaning up against a tree.
As I sat there reading, the feint scent of urine became perceptible and in fact, was in the soil and the tree. My jeans smelled of it and my shirt. I had to get inside and get out of those clothes immediately.
I started noticing that this was the case all over the green. There probably isn't a square inch of the place that isn't urine soaked, which really ticks me off and grosses me out. I feel like all the trees have to be hosed down and the entire lawn roto-tilled or something. It REALLY ticks me off and I REALLY dislike the men doing it. And I have been wondering if excessive levals of urine in soil has enough of any chemical substance to allow the state to declare it some sort of contaminated site.
This week I noticed portable toilets put out. It was probably for the concert but I hope they stay. It won't stop some of these guys from peeing wherever they please, but it has to help some. Thank you to whichever organization did it.
As to stereotyping, you can't really. there are homeless who are civilized, decent people who behave and care.
there are homeless people on the Green who are mentally ill and dual diagnosis, mentally ill, drug addicted.
There are homeless on the Green who are drug addicted and also degenerate criminals too who get zero sympathy from me. I do NOT feel sorry for people who insist on having criminal minds, like some people do.
there are homeless on the green who are just plain addicts
there are homeless who are just plain criminal.
there are all kinds.
Personally, I am tired of panhandling, not because I am opposed to someone poor asking me for money, but because I am tired of being asked for money five or six times a day and sometimes aggressively.
I had one guy who wouldn't take no for an answer and really came close to mugging me.
I do not feel sorry for any of these homeless people except for the decent ones who are doing the best they can.
Poverty doesn't make poor character somehow OK. I dislike poor jerks as much as rich ones.
So, yes I want to help the homeless find homes. I am, however, sick of trying ten, 20, 50 times to "Help" the ones who are homeless because they can't give up living like a pig, doing drugs, getting in fights, behaving badly all the time. Some of these guys hanging out downtown are that. Just remember, don't treat ALL of them as if they are, because not ALL of them are.
I have walked early in the mornings along the green and seen man after man get up from their sleeping benches and pee right there, barely bothering with any attempts at modest discretion.
I gave up the entire mistaken visions of a quiet morning stroll in a pretty setting - it was fantasy, not real, not on this green or this downtown.
guest (Guest)
I don't think the focus should be the "homeless" I think the focus should be on behaviors.
A homeless person sleeping on a bench, not littering, using the portable toilets instead of the ground in front of him etc -- what is his crime?
The guy who litters is a litterer, the guy who pees right there is violating laws, the guy who is yelling often at other guys (there is one guy who does that a lot) is creating a disturbance.
guest (Guest)
I don't think the focus should be the "homeless" I think the focus should be on behaviors.
A homeless person sleeping on a bench, not littering, using the portable toilets instead of the ground in front of him etc -- what is his crime?
The guy who litters is a litterer, the guy who pees right there is violating laws, the guy who is yelling often at other guys (there is one guy who does that a lot) is creating a disturbance.
E (Registered User)
Peeing - while I agree that it is not cool and smells - reasonably, where do you expect them to pee? The portapotties are not always there or available. They cant use the restaurants bathrooms because they get kicked out. The shelters are not necessarily handy or open. They have no home of their own. Yet, they are human and they have to pee just like the rest of us. As disgusting as it is - where do you expect them to go? Seriously - if you have an answer, a valid solution, then lets hear it and we can spread the word among the homeless at your option.
I am not saying this to be nasty or create a feud here. Im saying this because you complain but have no solution. You expect a lot of the homeless when they have no way to do it otherwise.
Just because there is someone who is homeless and happens to be a jerk, doesnt mean that hes not a jerk for a valid reason. Yes, it could very well be drugs or alcohol. But, its most often mental problems. They appear to be your basic average jerk but if you knew what was really going on deeper than what you see, you would understand why. Not saying its an excuse but it is another reason for finding VALID solutions to these issues.
A drunk and a drug abuser may not be just a drunk and drug abuser. "Quitting" is easier suggested than actually done. Just ask any cigarette smoker. Without insurance, without a place to go, without the resources, without welfare, without a job - how do you expect them to clean their act if someone WITH all these resources take many many times to kick the smoking habit.
I see a lot of expectations and complaints about the homeless and still no valid, reasonable solutions.
So back to the simple problems - trash, urinating. Oh wait, urinals are an easy "home" for the homeless, thats right. (Reflecting back to an argument awhile ago about this). They get removed and sometimes chained up to prevent overnight use. So, that means urinating on the Green again. Trash - well, as stated before, this is a universal problem. We need to start handing out littering tickets to everyone caught littering before we can even considering a real solution to the trash.
E (Registered User)
Also, about the guy that is often at the green yelling - did you know hes schizophrenic (classic symptoms)? He has no control over it without medication and treatment. How do you expect him to get it?
A hospital can only hold him for so long and the meds will run out while out on the street and no way to get more. The police can only jail him for so many hours before letting him go. Treatment centers can only hold him for several days before releasing. So again, please, solutions, not empty complaints.
Robert Menefee (Guest)
Robert Menefee (Guest)
E (Registered User)
E (Registered User)
robn (Registered User)
City of New Haven (Verified Official)
City of New Haven (Verified Official)
Closed City of New Haven (Registered User)